Bloody Linux

Posted on 2003/05/13 09:10:49 (May 2003) by john.

I tried, but I failed.

Ok, well I'm probably opening myself up for a lot of flaming here, but I'd like to publically declare that I hate linux. Last night I spent hours trying to get a very common network card to work on my linux installation.

I gave up after about three hours and at least two kernel recompiles. Every tiny little thing I wanted to do required extensive searching on Google Groups (which would have been impossible without a second PC), as the whole system is so totally unintuitive. Half the configuration programs in the menus wouldn't even run, the ones that did were totally misleading or just plain useless. In the end to just set up my standard network parameters (surely an exceedingly basic task) I had to install at least two new packages from the CD (which luckily I had kept). Again, this was a process that was totally unintuitive and not at all fun. However, all this was in vain, as the obscurely named module that acted as a driver for my network card wasn't included in my kernel. It seems like every time I try to do anything in Llinux I end up having to recompile that bloody kernel. This required more searching to work out how the hell to do it. I then spent a further age trying to configure the bootloader, until I eventually realised (after I'd given up) that the files for this only magically appear with one boot configuration (for no apparent reason). At the point at which I gave up I realised the act of trying to get my network card to work had somehow stopped my dvb-t card working.

This morning after a good night's sleep I managed to get my network card sort of working - I could ping the router at least. DHCP didn't seem to work though (I had to key in an IP address manually), and I didn't have a clue were to start setting up DNS, without which most internet applications are pretty much useless. However, my dvb-t card, the whole point of trying to get the network card running, would not work, and I have no idea how to fix that either.

So far, since I installed linux, out of the total time I have spent using it, 65% of that time has been recompiling the kernel, 30% pissing about with configuration files, and at best 5% doing anything actually useful. This is not a productive operating system. For all the woes of Windows, time spent there is probably more like 90% productive. OK admittedly, it is a slightly unfair comparison because I know Windows better, but still, when I consider the sorts of things I do on a semi regular basis, like installing new hardware, it usually takes about 5 minutes under Windows. Given a sample of the four bits of hardware I have so far tried to get working under Linux, it takes at least a day's effort per item. Sometimes I just give up altogether,

In essence, I can't really complain. This is free software, and to complain about it makes me sound extremely ungrateful for all the hard work people have put in (for free). Writing operating systems is not at all easy I imagine, given that everyone wants to do something slightly different with it. Also it is applaudible that the developers have created what, under some circumstances, could provide a real alternative to a commerical product that seems to be taking over the world.

However, this doesn't seem to win me over. Linux is just plain frustrating to use, and makes me feel really stupid. All of the benefits of linux aside, next time somebody whines on about how much better linux is than Windows, or tells me I should be doing XYZ on linux instead, I shall simply give them two random PCI cards and see if they still love linux so much after trying to install them.

Saw any chairs in half?

Posted by dsp at 2003/05/13 24:59:22.

I have never used Linux and therefore have no opinion on it right now. Also, Linux sucks ass.

Posted by Omar at 2003/05/13 13:27:08.

Ok well I'm prepared to take a bit of the above back. I have now managed to get my dvb-t card working again under linux (I had to recompile the driver it seems). It was still a very frustrating process to get to this point, but like I said, I guess operating systems are not easy things to write.

Posted by John at 2003/05/13 13:55:07.

P.S. Omar - I've noticed your comments on a few articles now. You're not the Omar are you? As in the pretzel king...?

Posted by John at 2003/05/13 13:56:29.

Day 50. Still no sign of reinforcements, or the requested lager. Beginning to think that a mission to the West Pole may have been a mistake. Huskies on strike.

Posted by Jimmy at 2003/05/13 15:01:53.

Do my ears look big in this?

Posted by Tony Blair at 2003/05/13 15:12:20.

Getting things working under Linux does seem to be a bit of a pain.. how much pain seems to depend on the distro you choose. Somethings work fine in RedHat that are totally broken in Debian - and vice versa.

The sound card in my laptop is a good example. Under RedHat 7.0 (and all subsequent versions) it works immediately and perfectly. Under Debian? No chance mate! Not without recompiling the kernel (which I will leave it doing when I'm down the pub tonight...)

Things are moving on in the LInux world. The fact that you got your dvB card working is a good sign. These things have traditionally been a 'bit tricky'. Which network card did you choose? If you're using a common, 3com or Intel 82559 based card you'd be fine straight off. Even my Realtek card is supported without hassle... again this is usually due to distro and the kernel you chose when asked during installation.

The bootloader (lilo) is a bit difficult to use until you get used to it, but works quite effectively.... you could always convice the Windows boot loader to boot linux for you.

I'll agree that Linux is hardly the OS of choice for giving to your granny or your mum, but you and I are both Computer Scientists (note I didn't say IT there).... It *is* tricky and a bit of a bastard sometimes, but if you give up without reporting the errors you find then Linux will never improve and Uncle Bill's Empire will continue to get fatter and fatter.

Posted by tom at 2003/05/13 16:54:02.

At least ‘Line-ux’ doesn’t send you off to press the ‘any key’ where ever the faq that is!

Posted by Karl at 2003/05/14 12:32:39.

The trub is John, in Windows you know that nearly every piece of hardware works in Windows, to a degree. However, even in nice fluffy safe Windows, if you haven’t got the correct driver then the card ain’t gonna work. With ‘Line-ux’, check that the hardware is supported first before attempting an install.

However, if you find Red Hat difficult and someone say’s “why don’t you try Debian?”, save yourself a lot of misery and kick ‘em in the bollox and say “faq off you flash git!”

Posted by Karl at 2003/05/14 12:40:34.

Oh, one other tip, if you end-up scrubbing the ‘Line-ux’ and re-installing Windows again, the Windows install won’t wipe the boot sector meaning Windows won’t boot, so try fdisk/mbr, or summut like that

Posted by Karl at 2003/05/14 12:48:20.

I'm trying to use Linux as a laptop environment rather than Windows. Everything is looking quite doable... except that most websites use IE specific components. Mozilla, she no like.

Posted by tom at 2003/05/14 08:54:41.

Isn't the latest MacOS based on Linux? Doesn't that mean you could potentially run it on yer PC? If I could run Mac stuff on my PC I'd be a happy chappy indeed.

Posted by Jimmy at 2003/05/14 11:10:44.

I might have know that the biggest comment would be Tom's

Posted by dsp at 2003/05/14 24:02:12.

MacOS 10 (OSX) *is* Unix, but not Linux. It's a BSD dereivative I believe.

Even if it were, the binaries are compiled for the PowerPC processor not the Intel family. You'd have to getthe source code... and then there would be driver issues, and none of the applications would run for the same reasons.... NAH!

Posted by tom at 2003/05/14 13:32:45.

'sup John. Yeah it is I, the one, the only..... Omar. Came across your site a while ago and decided to pop by occasionally to see how things are going. Oh and hey Stone Henge is pretty cool in an 'oh, okay. Lunch anyone?' sort of way. It could do with some hooded people chanting or something.

Posted by Omar at 2003/05/14 16:18:16.

Read: http://www.rowan.me.uk/node.php?id=132

Posted by tom at 2003/05/15 20:11:38.

I just bought a used computer that
had linux suse 8.0 system , It was my first time running this system, I turn on my computer and came to where I been asked to type my user name and pass word. but my key board did not function, I check connection evry thing is the way should be. please someone let me know what is wrong , am I doing something wrong. please anser me soon thank you

Posted by sirous k. at 2003/12/07 05:37:50.

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